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Mik3y
Starlite Member
Username: Mik3y
| | Posted on Thursday, September 23, 2010 - 05:21 am: | 
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Antipodi the word Holy is used to describe even earthly people so i don't see why you'd say mary is not Holy. If you read the wedding at cana for example you will see that marys role is not so clear cut as you first said.
No one see's mary as a god or goddess. Name me one religion that does? please.
Another problem i have with your statement is this idea that the dead are in graves awaiting the second coming. That is not true. Christ himself grants eternal salvation then and there to a man next to him. The Bible is full of messages telling us that Christ's death and resurection was to grant us eternal salvation.
It is said that mary was born without sin, that her whole life she devoted to the will of God. She is even linked to the idea of the new eve. To term her a 'flawed' human isn't really founded. She is human without a doubt. She was also specifically chosen by God. Some people argue that God could have used anyone. That might be true if humans were robots programed only to love and serve God. But you would be forgeting that God would need marys approval. This fact can not be skipped over so quickly because we can make false assumptions about mary and her role. There have been evidence of pagans worshiping pregnant women like statues this is true. But this does not automaticaly mean that mother mary is a by product of this. One particular reason stands out and that is that those pagan mother god statues were worshipped in themselves. I do not know a church that worships statues of mary nor worships mary.
If we are to take the Hail mary prayer for instance you can clearly see that she is only called blessed, holy, and the mother of God. That last point is because we believe Jesus Christ is God. It is not to mean that God was created by mary. That would be impossible. But read over that prayer anyway and you will see that any worship or adoration is only giving to Jesus inside the mothers womb.
As for intercession the Bible is full of stories of people interceding between man and God. We even see people pray for their dead family members. Some people misquote scripture to say that praying to the dead is evil. But that passage they refer to is talking about those who worship, adore or ask things of their dead relatives etc treating them like Gods or their relics like God. If we pray for our grandfathers salvation or ask God to take care of him, or ask our grandfather to pray for us that is not the same thing. I mean what do you think we will do in heaven if not prayer lol, the thought of not praying in heaven is just ridiculous.
As for preservation of the Bible. If you actually look at what books have made it and what haven't [they are available by the way none are hidden away in some dark cabinet that the church doesn't want you to find lol] simply go to the vatican site to read them or some other website or purchase printed copies whatever. The Book we have today is very close to the original with only small variations in insignificant words.
But here's a nice one for sola scriptura readers. The bible says "This is my body and this is my blood" there is no biblical mention of a symbol or grape juice that is protestant tradition and doctrine.
Michael william James
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Lottie457
Starlite Member
Username: Lottie457
| | Posted on Thursday, July 30, 2009 - 01:11 am: |
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My Apologies to AbbasEwe Debera UHW
In reply to your email,
Debra, I apologize but I did not read the FTD or CTSS posts after
I entered my poem this time. The last week of the month is always a busy one,
so I deleted them as they were sent to me and read only individual emails. Thus
I missed any remarks you may have made about me thereafter.
But I did catch the one about you feeling that I am perhaps too “strict” about
what’s posted in the traditional challenges when I host. Oh please let me explain:
I.was.just.kidding.
I’m sowwy, if you want a more in depth explanation than that I don’t have it for you, lol.
As far as being alone talking to myself on the Board when I‘ve hosted, LOL, sometimes the last 2-3 days have tapered off. Rather than get angry or leave the board until the end of the Challenge or leave the board altogether, lol, I’ve always chosen to take advantage of the dead time to post and play on the Board by myself. I don’t host often and of course would rather always have a hopping board, but if not I’m delighted to have the opportunity to do so. My closest sister is 8 years older than I so I’m one to enjoy my own imagination and company if need-be.
LOL, In regards to my poem “The Shut-In” that I believe you’re referring to, I knew I was putting myself out there when I posted it. Many of my poems are fantasy, but once in a while I do post a reality based poem. I didn’t do it for sympathy, so readers can derive anything they want from it, even a laugh.
I posted it because I think it’s one of my best writes. While many poems are repeatedly about the focus on a whole prism, I felt I captured an angle of light that flashes and then disappears forever, and I can’t do that very often. But when I do or I see another poet catch it, my admiration is high~
But you’re right. Most of my poetry at that time was pure nonsense due the pain I was in from gangrene, blood clotting, hemorrhaging, anemia, infection, collapsed veins, etc. I mean you could’ve knocked me over with a feather, lol. And at times I took out my rosary beads and muttered like a madman, wondering if it was to God or merely myself, lol
But I would like to think it was God which is why I can walk and function again, and this time with a little more independence of self that only that time of aloneness can bring along with a tree that I believed I was the only who could see it for what it really was, lolololol. But I certainly didn’t invent it as a source of contention between us~
This poem on the Internet relates some of how I feel at times,
Tao of love
After a while, you learn the subtle difference between holding a hand and chaining a soul.
And you learn that love does not mean leaning and company does not mean security.
And you begin to learn that kisses are not contracts and presents are not promises.
And you begin to accept rejection with your head up and your eyes clear, with the grace
of an adult, not the heartache of a child.
And you learn to build your life on now, because tomorrow is too uncertain.
After a while you learn that even sunshine burns if you get too much.
Plant your own garden and decorate your soul, instead of waiting for someone to bring you flowers.
And after a while you learn that you really have infinite worth.
Author Unknown
As I emailed Tiny Teddy months ago and most recently God’s Little Whispers, it was a horrendous, insanely painful time.
When one experiences pain that nearly devours you you tend to either become hardened to others or more empathic. It’s really not totally a choice but one’s nature I guess. I tend to take other’s problems to heart. But I will also be among the first to celebrate a true friend’s triumphs and happiness. What I find most crazy is when someone states or writes how happy they are, but even their happiness feels sad. Lol.
Well, I hope this straightens things out a bit. I apologize if it doesn’t.
Please know I’m not a self-righteous person nor do I have a shame-based personality/character thus I also apologize for confusing you, as that’s what flexibility sometimes does.
Well I gotta skadaddle. I spent more time on this return letter to you than I originally intended.
And not to worry, Deb. Our friendship is the same as it always was. I think you’ve written some very good poems.
Please, I’m Sorry, Thank You
Lottie
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Mik3y
Starlite Member
Username: Mik3y
| | Posted on Thursday, July 09, 2009 - 09:53 am: |
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hmm few things that tell me christ should make his second coming is stem cell research, gay marriage and abortion. I have no idea why abortion is labeled a religious issue when it has nothing to do with religion. What cannot be debated is that a fetus is a human being however its argued that the fetus is not a human person. I disagree and will call it how it is once fertilisation occurs there is a human person and human being inside the womb and i dont say that from any religious perspective i say that from common sense and in love for all mankind. God bless you - miCk.
Michael william James
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Jillchuang
Starlite Member
Username: Jillchuang
| | Posted on Sunday, May 03, 2009 - 10:45 am: |
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God's words....the truth
Jesus is our salvation
He is known as the word
God's words...the truth
If we know the truth,
the truth will set us free.
The word of Jehovah God is sharp like sword
With power and authority.
Men don't live by bread alone
They live by God's words...the truth
If we speak the truth, God lives with us
If we lie, we are speaking the words
of the evil ones, father of all liars.
May God's words...the truth
be with us in our hearts
and our life for always.
Christian brothers & sisters, please help to spread the good news of God !
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Pmbulo
Starlite Member
Username: Pmbulo
| | Posted on Monday, February 02, 2009 - 12:53 am: |
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Truthseeker: “but what of the first rapture, it hasn’t come yet...”
POTPHER: I’m wondering if you read through what I wrote. What I said was the first letter of Paul to the church at Thessalonica was written during his first missionary journey around 50-51 AD. By that time, the First Rapture had already occurred in 30/33 AD. Paul was looking forward to the Second Rapture which he said was tied to the resurrection of those who have fallen asleep in Christ i.e. the New Testament saints.
The First Rapture occurred when Jesus was ascending (during the ascension). You can read this in Matthews 27: 50 - 53
“The tombs were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised; and coming out of the tombs after his resurrection they entered into the holy city and appeared unto many"
The people who were raptured were the saints of the Old Testament. Yes all those who were in Abraham's Bosom (side) which was a part of hell. The word Bosom means side and in this case, the Abraham's side of hell. The souls of these saints could not be in the immediate presence of God because their sins were just covered and but not washed away. Remember that sin could not be forgiven (washed away) by the shading of blood of bulls (Hebrews 10: 1 - 4). Yes David and the rest of the patriarchs had had their sins just covered but never washed away until Christ's death at the cross. Hence they (Old Testament saints) looked forward to the future for Christ to pay for their sins while waiting in Sheol (but in Abraham's side of hell). It is no wonder that David said in Psalms 16: 9 - 10
“THEREFORE MY HEART IS GLAD AND MY TONGUE REJOICES; MY BODY ALSO WILL REST SECURE, BECAUSE YOU WILL NOT ABANDON ME IN SHEOL NOR WILL YOU LET YOUR HOLY ONE SEE DECAY. "
NOTE: The original Hebrew word SHEOL means hell but is rendered as "grave" by many bible translations. See also Psalms 86:13; Psalms 89:48 and Job 14:13-17.
Abraham's bosom was indeed a part of hell as evident in Luke 16:19-31. Notice that ".....he looked up...." and thus Abraham's bosom was a top part of hell. Jesus also proclaimed in HADES (hell). This is found in 1 Peter 3:18-20. I can also add and say that fallen angels are also chained in TARTARUS the lowest region of hell. See Jude 6 and 2 Peter 2:4. Now Abraham's bosom is no more because of the FIRST RAPTURE that took place in 30/33 AD See Matthews 27: 50 - 53 and also Ephesians 4: 7 - 9.
A few extrabiblical sources did expand Matthew's tale of the many raised saints. These expansions were composed over one hundred years after Matthew's gospel was written. Remarkably, they even mentioned the names of some of the "many saints" raised, like Simeon and his sons, Adam and Eve, the patriarchs and prophets, etc., names that Matthew neglected to include. Of course, these expansions of the two extraordinary verses in Matthew and the list of names are found only in apocryphal gospels,
Truthseeker: “i do belive in the rapture, im just wondering why your focusing on the second of three, the first will come and create widespread panic, and enthrown the antichrist due to that fear.”
POTPHER: Like I said, the First Rapture occurred in 30/33 AD. I hope I’ve made myself clear.
Shalom! Shalom!
Ever-loving,
Potpher
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Truthseeker
Starlite Member
Username: Truthseeker
| | Posted on Thursday, January 29, 2009 - 01:43 pm: |
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but what of the first rapture,it hasent come yet...its amazing where this started and where its at now,very nice discussion,just remember christ said where there are two in my name,there i am.amen,oh,i do belive in the rapture,im just wondering why your focusing on the second of three,the first will come and create widespread panic,and enthrown the antichrist due to that fear.am i wrong here,i mean im just learning so correct me,i love being wrong,means i just learned somthing,and wont there be three raptures?
Trevor Lee Avery
TRUTHSEEKER
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Pmbulo
Starlite Member
Username: Pmbulo
| | Posted on Thursday, January 29, 2009 - 01:14 am: |
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Truthseeker : “……but, the great trib is more devestating in the case that it WILL be worldwide. This will take place after the illuminatti make the one world currency, one world religon, and one world nation in the name of peace. The new world order. "
POTPHER: I’m enjoying this discussion. Whether it’s the illuminatti or the Pope or some renowned world class leader to form a new world order, what I know from the book of Daniel is that there shall be no complete one world government just as clay and iron cannot mix. Yes an attempt will be made and has already started by the EU nations but they will not realize it. I understand what you mean.
Truthseeker: “sadly, to those who say mary is one with god the father have been tought this thru strict teachings of catholisism, i grew up as a jehovas witness, so i was tought that crist was meerly a prophet, but i actually read and learned later in my life, i put aside what i was tought in order to see why what i was tought dident stand up to the bibles explination."
POTPHER: Congratulations. That is the way forward. We should seek the truth by subjecting our current belief to strict scrutiny. No single denomination knows it all. They all know it part.
Antipodi: “Gods people will be resurrected from Sleeping ( or as we know it death) on that day including Mary( although God will judge if ANY of us are worthy) "
POTPHER: How can Mary be interceding on our behalf yet she is sleeping??? Is it possible to pacify a god when you are fast asleep??? I need to know, learn and acquire this skill of placating the gods in death. I mean no offense. I’m just confused to see you contradicting yourself. Kindly explain please.
Antipodi: “However as with Truthseekers statement about the last days ( and believe me we are in them) the bible does mention powerful people influenced by Satan making decisions about enforced counterfeit religions for mass earth rule and the arms of that are being formed now....I do believe the Earth has only little time before Christs return with his angels and what a glorious day that will be for believers ... "
POTPHER: I totally agree with you. The day for His coming is near. We are in the end times.
THE SECOND RAPTURE
The SECOND RAPTURE is tied to the resurrection of the New Testament saints
1. Thessalonians 4:13-17. “BROTHERS WE DO NOT WANT YOU TO BE IGNORANT CONCERNING THOSE THAT FALL ASLEEP, OR TO GRIEVE LIKE THE REST OF THE MEN, WHO HAVE NO HOPE. WE BELIEVE THAT JESUS DIED AND ROSE AGAIN SO WE BELIEVE THAT GOD WILL BRING WITH JESUS THOSE WHO HAVE FALLEN ASLEEP IN HIM. ACCORDING TO THE LORD'S OWN WORD, WE TELL YOU THAT WE WHO ARE STILL ALIVE, WHO ARE LEFT TILL THE COMING OF THE LORD, WILL CERTAINLY NOT PRECEDE THOSE WHO HAVE FALLEN ASLEEP. FOR THE LORD HIMSELF WILL COME DOWN FROM HEAVEN, WITH A LOUD COMMAND, WITH THE VOICE OF AN ARCHANGEL AND WITH THE TRUMPET CALL OF GOD. AND THE DEAD IN CHRIST WILL ARISE FIRST. AFTER THAT, WE WHO ARE STILL ALIVE AND ARE LEFT WILL BE CAUGHT UP TO MEET THE LORD IN THE AIR. AND SO WE WILL BE WITH THE LORD FOR EVER. THEREFORE ENCOURAGE EACH OTHER WITH THESE WORDS. "
The first letter of Paul to the church at Thessalonia was written during his first missionary journey around 50-51 AD. By that time, the First Rapture had already occurred in 30/33 AD. Paul was looking forward to the Second Rapture which he said was tied to the resurrection of those who have fallen asleep in Christ i.e. the new testament saints.
The First Rapture occurred when Jesus was ascending (during the ascension). The people who were raptured were the saints of the Old Testament. Yes all those who were in Abraham's Bosom (side) which was a part of hell. The word Bosom means side and in this case, the Abraham's side of hell. The souls of these saints could not be in the immediate presence of God because their sins were just covered and but not washed away. Remember that sin could not be forgiven (washed away) by the shading of blood of bulls (Hebrews 10: 1 - 4). Yes David and the rest of the patriarchs had had their sins just covered but never washed away until Christ's death at the cross. Hence they (Old Testament saints) looked forward to the future for Christ to pay for their sins while waiting in Sheol (but in Abraham's side of hell). It is no wonder that David said in Psalms 16: 9 - 10
“THEREFORE MY HEART IS GLAD AND MY TONGUE REJOICES; MY BODY ALSO WILL REST SECURE, BECAUSE YOU WILL NOT ABANDON ME IN SHEOL NOR WILL YOU LET YOUR HOLY ONE SEE DECAY."
NOTE: The original Hebrew word SHEOL means hell but is rendered as "grave" by many bible translations. See also Psalms 86:13; Psalms 89:48 and Job 14:13-17.
Abraham's bosom was indeed a part of hell as evident in Luke 16:19-31. Notice that ".....he looked up...." and thus Abraham's bosom was a top part of hell. Jesus also proclaimed in HADES (hell). This is found in 1 Peter 3:18-20. I can also add and say that fallen angels are also chained in TARTARUS the lowest region of hell. See Jude 6 and 2 Peter 2:4. Now Abraham's bosom is no more because of the FIRST RAPTURE that took place in 30/33 AD See Matthews 27: 50 - 53 and also Ephesians 4: 7 - 9.
The SECOND RAPTURE is thus to occur in Revelation 6:9-11. Yes it would occur in the opening of the sixth seal:
“WHEN HE OPENED THE FIFTH SEAL, I SAW UNDER THE ALTER THE SOULS OF THOSE WHO HAD BEEN SLAIN BECAUSE OF THE WORD OF GOD AND THE TESTIMONY THEY HAD MAINTAINED. THEY CALLED OUT IN A LOUD VOICE, "HOW LONG, SOVEREIGN LORD, HOLY AND TRUE, UNTIL YOU JUDGE THE INHABITANTS OF THE EARTH AND AVENGE OUR BLOOD?" THEN EACH WAS GIVEN A WHITE ROBE (new resurrected body), AND WERE TOLD TO WAIT A LITTLE LONGER, UNTIL THEIR FELLOW SERVANTS AND BROTHERS WERE TO BE KILLED AS THEY HAD BEEN WAS COMPLETE."
The question is: where are they to wait?
My answer is the air.
For how long shall they wait?
Answer: For 42 months until mid way the Tribulation for the Third Rapture.
I can say that I for one will be a candidate of this RAPTURE. I might see it take place while I'm still alive unless I die early but surely it's going to take place soon and very soon before the onset of the Great Tribulation.
In 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 you will notice that in verse 17 that the saints (both living and those asleep will be caught up to meet the Lord in the "clouds" (nephele in Greek) and then he repeats but says meet in "air" (aēr in Greek) He did not say we shall meet the lord in paradise (paradeisos in Greek meaning Of Oriental origin, a park, that is, specifically an Eden -place of future happiness, “paradise”).
Paul was careful in the usage of words so that there should be no confusion in our times of unlocking the Prophesy. The Lord Jesus Christ is not going to step on the earth during the SECOND RAPTURE. The word "air" in this case does not mean physical air. If it did then after the rapture, the raptured saints will be seen floating in the air or sky forever as a consequence of verse 17 ".......AND SO SHALL WE BE WITH THE LORD FOR EVER." Ladies and gentlemen, the "air" means a region in heaven.
There are at least three heavens. See 2 Corinthians 12:2-4
“I know a man in Christ. Fourteen years ago-whether in his body or outside of his body, I do not know, but God knows-that man was snatched away to the third heaven. I know that this man-whether in his body or outside of his body, I do not know, but God knows, was snatched away to Paradise and heard things that cannot be expressed in words, things that no human being has a right even to mention."
If there is a third heaven then there is a first and second heaven. At least we know that the THIRD HEAVEN is paradise as written in verse 4. It seems to me that the man Paul was talking about was himself but twisted the language to cover up in his "boasting". He must have had in his vision traveled through this hayrack of heavens to the third heaven. In the book of Daniel, there is an interesting account of this hayrack of heavens. See Daniel 10:12-13; 20-31 Again read Ephesians 6:12. The "air" is a region in heaven precisely the Second Heaven and is the blockade or barrier where the principalities reside.
By now you realise that all wicked rulers on earth have principalities (demons or Satan's messengers) assigned to them in the Second Heaven which is also called the "air". Indeed Satan is also known as the Prince of the "air" just as it is written: “.....according to the prince of the power of the air (aēr in Greek), the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience." [Eph. 2:2]
The first heaven is physical i.e. the outer space. The other two are spiritual realms. The second heaven is the "air" i.e. the region in heaven where principalities reside. The saints will meet the Lord there. But first the devil and his messengers have to be kicked out of the "air" (the Second Heaven). Immediately after that there will be the occurrence of the SECOND RAPTURE. The WAR in heaven is tied together with the SECOND RAPTURE. Friends see Daniel 12:1-4. In this potion of scripture, to "arise" means to battle. Immediately after that, the rapture occurs. Since the resurrection of the New Testament saints is tied to the Second Rapture which is tied to the WAR. Then we have to find this resurrection. It is in Revelation 6:11-12.
It is clear then that the fourth seal Rev. 6:7-8 is the time of distress. This is our days now. The fifth seal contains the Second Rapture. The Great Tribulation is in the sixth seal Rev. 6:12-17 Which will intensify after the Third Rapture in Revelation 7:3-17. Yes the remainder of the 3 and ½ years of the great tribulation are in the Seventh Seal i.e. the seven trumpets of chapter 8, 9, 10 and 11 of the book of Revelation. The Seventh seal is itemised into seven trumpets.
It is important to note that Jesus Christ emphasizes on the SECOND RAPTURE by retelling it in form of a vision. Yes the Book of Revelation refocuses again on the SECOND RAPTURE in chapter 12. I know this chapter is very contravention among us believers but I have no apologies to make.
Shalom! Shalom!
Ever-loving,
Potpher
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Truthseeker
Starlite Member
Username: Truthseeker
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 01:59 pm: |
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ok,so the illuminatti arent in the bible,yes its just an opinion.but look into the scull and bones freturnity a little bit somtime.just peek at it,or maybe even dab into alex jones for a little info.i know a lot of you will diagree with me on this one.like the fact that jfk was shot is because he spoke aginst secret societys.take a look at that speech somtime and wonder...whos watching you?those chips they put in your dogs,its all a sign,they will start puting them in your doughters and sons,thats a fact,and while the reasons may seem great,people this aint great,if christ were our goverment it would be..but as satan told jesus in the tempting in the wilderness,"i can give you all of this if you worship me"thats right,words of satan,its his for now,and he raigns supreem...for now.you already know this,and while some of what i say is opinion,you cant think that is,ok,i dont want to dwell into it to much,you guys,and girls have been very understanding to my belifes,thanks for that,and im not trying to offend.just take it with a grain of salt.fact is,if you belive in jesus as your savior,none of what i just said matters,be sure that you never reject him.in time thay will demand you to.
Trevor Lee Avery
TRUTHSEEKER
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Antipodi
Starlite Member
Username: Antipodi
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 01:10 pm: |
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Wow it is great to see that the truth will out with an intelligent discussion ...much of what Truthseeker says is true and I thank him for the kind and understanding way he has put some sticky issues especially where Mary is concerned ..you certainly live up to your name...fact is look to the original bible the closest these days being the King James version ..not one that has been "adapted to suit a particular faith" for the bible in its original state was universal for one overall true faith of all peoples the New Testament has many references to this and I think in Daniel as well..
anyhow where I differ with Truthseeker is on the matter of the Illuminati ..these people are basically myth and not anywhere in the bible are they mentioned ...However as with Truthseekers statement about the last days ( and believe me we are in them) the bible does mention powerful people influenced by Satan making decisions about enforced counterfeit religions for mass earth rule and the arms of that are being formed now....I do believe the Earth has only little time before Christs return with his angels and what a glorious day that will be for believers ...
Gods people will be resurrected from Sleeping ( or as we know it death) on that day including Mary( although God will judge if ANY of us are worthy) to be taken back to heaven(that is Christs promise and legacy to us) as the bible says in many references especially in the Revelation and Daniel |
Truthseeker
Starlite Member
Username: Truthseeker
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 11:57 am: |
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on the last two coments i wanted to share a little,if i may:to potpher, i do agree with most of what your saying...most,im just one person with one understanding but here is where i disagree,revelations,amung other books like danial speak of the futer of their time...but even further past the time period that the temple fell around ad 70-75,i know that this is not based on john saying look,this is about 1942,or 1311,the bible dosent work that way.our bible has been manipulated to an extreem,and opinions did this to gods word,mankind is always trying to fix it to say just what elavates them,brings them into power.but christ told us to be aware of these false teachers.revelations talks about the great tribulation potpher,and that hasent...quite come yet,sure,i know about the roman persecution,i know how nero and many others tore christians to shreds in the arena while using others to light aflame in the streets as lamps,and how even after rome thru constintine became a "so called" christian empire thru the founding of the catholic church killed those who stood aginst romes way of worship,or even translated the bible from latin to their native toung whatever it was.but,the great trib is more devestating in the case that it WILL be worldwide.this will take place after the illuminatti make the one world currency,one world religon,and one world nation in the name of peace.the new world order.i know i know,most people laugh at people like me.im no prophet,i love jesus,he is my light,i can hardly spell,but i do it anyway,just to shine what little light i know of.people,mary was most likely a great and dear woman.i'll simply break this case of mary now with a scripture beond qustian,in mark chapter 3,verses 31-33 it says, {nlt}then jesus' mother and brothers came to see him,thay stood outside and sent word for him to come out and talk with them.there was a croud siting around him,and someone said, "your mother and your brothers are outside asking for you"jesus replied,who is my mother?who are my brothers?then he looked at those around him and said"look,these are my mother and my brothers,anyone who does gods will is my brother,sister,and mother"{end}
sadly,to those who say mary is one with god the father have been tought this thru strict teachings of catholisism,i grew up as a jehovas witness,so i was tought that crist was meerly a prophet,but i actually read and learned later in my life,i put aside what i was tought in order to see why what i was tought dident stand up to the bibles explination.so to anyone,anyone at all who says mary is one with the father,please,base that on scripture.not on your catholic textbooks,i mean this in all fairness,i have no ill will towards any religeous sect,save jihad who kill for no reason,but i even wish them to convert to see the truth,please.each one of you,correct me where you see fit and i'll take the correction with a joyous reply,but base your imput on scripture.
Trevor Lee Avery
TRUTHSEEKER
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Pmbulo
Starlite Member
Username: Pmbulo
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 04:43 am: |
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Ompapa: “The mother teaches the child from birth... The child may have a memory from the crib, ……..Mary is one with God as are we all... Spirit is One. "God is a Spirit"
POTPHER: We have a problem here. Some people have elevated Mary above any imagination because of misunderstanding Revelation Chapter 12. But the key to understanding the book of Revelation is to note the year in which it was written by John the Apostle. First of all, we should understand that Potius Pilate the Governor at Jerusalem who presided over the verdict of crucifying Jesus Christ reigned about 26 - 30 AD. Of course bible scholars say that the Crucifixion occurred in 30/33 AD. The final last fall of Jerusalem (the dispensation of Jews) occurred in 70 AD during the late reign of Nero the Roman. Again, it's go on and say that the Book of Revelation opens with the words in Revelation 1:1
THE REVELATION OF JESUS CHRIST THAT WHICH GOD GAVE HIM TO SHOW HIS SERVANTS WHAT MUST SOON TAKE PLACE........
This is the introduction of the book and be careful to note that it does not say WHAT TOOK PLACE but only WHAT MUST SOON TAKE PLACE. Therefore I can safely say that what ever follows hence forth after this first verse, all the way to the end of the book happened or would happen after the period 90 - 95 AD. Thus I conclude that the CRUCIFIXION, the ASSERTION and the DISPENSATION is not included in the book of Revelation. I have allowed scriptures to conclude the matter and hence forth only scriptures should interpret scriptures.
The Woman, The Son and The Dragon
To begin with let me say that the woman in Chapter 12 is not Merry the mother of Jesus. I say so because Merry did not go into the wilderness for 42 months after giving birth. It is true, Merry went to Egypt after giving birth to Jesus and then she went to Nazareth (Mathew 2:13-23). But this is not the basis for assuming that the woman is Marry. I had earlier pointed out that the Book of Revelation contains information about things that would occur after 90 AD as specified in Rev. 1:1 In this respect Merry is out of time and thus not applicable.
Again the woman in chapter 12 is not the nation of Israel. I say so because Israelites did not go into the wilderness for 42 months after Jesus was born. It is true, the dispensation occurred there after but not immediately in 4/6 BC but in 70 AD and lasted many years until 1948 AD contrary to the 3 and ½ years (42 months). Again if it were for so, it would violet Rev. 1:1.
The church is considered or is representatively the bride of the Lamb of God (Christ the Redeemer). See John 3:27-30 Indeed the woman is the church that will be raptured from the earth to the wilderness (empty space or uninhabited region i.e. the "air"). Mat 6:10 “Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven." The will of the Father is that the Church reaches maturity. Yes this is signified as Christ being "fully born" in the church (body of Jesus Christ). Gal 4:19 “My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you.
I for one, anticipate a mighty revival to} take place soon. It will sweep across the whole world and it has already started. Think about the TV evangelism. Who would have thought of such new methods of reaching out? A hunger for the word of God has already begun. Mar 16:15 “And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature." This command will be fulfilled soon. I mean Christ is being preached to all nations as never before amidst our time of distress ( ....crying out in pain in readiness to give birth) Giving birth means therefore reaching maturity and fulfilling the call of Jesus Christ as commanded in Matt. 24:14 “And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come." And also Act 1:8 “But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth."
Shalom! Shalom!
Ever-loving,
Potpher
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Pmbulo
Starlite Member
Username: Pmbulo
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 03:58 am: |
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Antipodi: “The modern concept of Mary as an intercessor to God is sadly misgiven and has NO basis on fact...
POTPHER: The elevation of Mary to above sainthood was done by the Catholic Church in the medieval church history in an attempt to woo pagans who had a similar belief of a goddess. Martin Luther, in the dark ages, fought this falsehood and many other improper doctrines.
Shalom! Shalom!
Ever-loving,
Potpher
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Antipodi
Starlite Member
Username: Antipodi
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 27, 2009 - 06:46 pm: |
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dear Truthseeker I like you agree with your comments we spend too much time putting our hopes on a human that we forget it was Christ who interceeded for us and listens to our prayers NOT MARY |
Truthseeker
Starlite Member
Username: Truthseeker
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 27, 2009 - 04:08 pm: |
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such a touchy topic,mostly amung catholics.we'll,let me play with it a little.the bible talks about mary in many verses.no where is mary called sinless,nope...sorry.christ even calls her "woman" while on the cross,mary is not devine..why is this so hard to comprehend,mary was chosen to be a vessel.thats it,but im sure god found favor in her to choose her,that dosent mean she is rightous,or devine,and really really dosent merit people praying to her.stop focusing on the mother of jesus and focus on jesus.love peace and chickin grease.
Trevor Lee Avery
TRUTHSEEKER
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Antipodi
Starlite Member
Username: Antipodi
| | Posted on Saturday, January 10, 2009 - 03:35 pm: |
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Mary is dead ..she is not a God nor immortal...God and his angels are immortal we forfieted our right when we sinned and ONLY Christ can intercede for us... |
Welshbard_00
Starlite Member
Username: Welshbard_00
| | Posted on Saturday, January 10, 2009 - 06:07 am: |
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Mary intercedes for us by her prayer..... |
Welshbard_00
Starlite Member
Username: Welshbard_00
| | Posted on Saturday, January 10, 2009 - 05:56 am: |
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who is we?
As an Orthodox christian, we do not worship Mary, she is venerated as the Theotokos, one who completely opened herself to God to become God bearer. Of course in Holy Scripture she herself foretells that "all generations shall call me blessed." Lk 1:48 and before that, Elizabeth exclaims...:Blessed art thou among women and blessed is the fruit of thy womb..." |
Antipodi
Starlite Member
Username: Antipodi
| | Posted on Friday, January 09, 2009 - 08:31 pm: |
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Sadly we believe in the divinity of Mary because we confuse it with Pagan religions (Dianna worship) and we forget one major important thing when dealing with Christs life with his mother Mary..Christ was a devine birth of a God being born of a human and we compliment ourselves when we say one our humans taught Christ how to behave
...WE DIDNT Mary was chosen because of her devotion to God and NOT because she was holy ..Mary only provided an envioronment for Christ to grow in his Knowledge came from his Father GOD not a flawed human being...This misconception saddens me...
The other thing that gets up my craw is Mary is NOT in heaven She sleeps and awaits Christs second coming as we all do...the dead are asleep and await Christs return ...which I believe is soon...
Having said that Mary does not intercede for us to God THAT is CHRISTS role he came to earth to be Human for 30 years and now stands before the thrown of his father pleading for us |
Ompapa
Starlite Member
Username: Ompapa
| | Posted on Friday, January 09, 2009 - 08:10 am: |
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There are many dimensions and realities, For, where you are in consciousness is your reality.
Life as we know it is an apparent electronic signature within the body. Yet, Spirit is the observer and "Player" as it were, directing these bodies within the rules and parameters of "The Game" we call life. Mary, and indeed Christ Himself is a player as it were... One or two may be the actual over soul, God/s playing all roles. This is not to say the game has no relevance. To discover Whom We truly are within the rules of the game seems to me to be the object...Degrees of enlightenment may well be points toward the completion of the game or illusion. Certain degrees must be attained to realization. Why would this seem more far fetched that any other cosmology or paradigm? Love, Ompapa |
Ompapa
Starlite Member
Username: Ompapa
| | Posted on Friday, January 09, 2009 - 07:28 am: |
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The mother teaches the child from birth... The child may have a memory from the crib, I do... I remember my family appearing and disappearing, Yet, it was my constant sleeping and awakening that gave this illusion. I remember much more that could be embarrassing to people, at a very young age.
Mary is one with God as are we all... Spirit is One. "God is a Spirit", Jesus told the woman at the well in Samaria. He said: "We are One, The Father in Me, Thee in Me and I in Thee"... God knew us before we were born because That is when We were created in His Image as Spirit, Not at birth as a human Being... Read the word as Spirit, not from the standpoint of the lowly human We appear to be... Be not dismayed that You are more than You appear to one another and self. The Child Jesus had to be oriented by Mary. This is why She was chosen... Love, Light and Blessings, Ompapa |
Antipodi
Starlite Member
Username: Antipodi
| | Posted on Thursday, December 04, 2008 - 01:51 pm: |
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I'd like to hear your opinion on the importance of Mary both in Christs life and now...
Firstly in the nativity the most important character is Christ and his destiny on the cross..he most certainly was holy of God
Secondly Mary was a created being lower than the Angels and a mortal..her role although important was that of a mother to Christ on earth not to become holy ..only God can do that..
It is my belief that although Mary was special she was only human and now sleeps in her grave waiting for Christ to return...
The modern concept of Mary as an intercessor to God is sadly misgiven and has NO basis on fact...
Confusion on Mary seems to have started when Constantine compromised faith and incorporate pagan beliefs into the church elevating Mary to a virgin goddess and NOT a human
I am not trying to insult anybodies belief only tring to work with facts and not myth as seems to have occured..in fact it maligns a very special lady in our history to believe she was and is a mythical figure this makes me sad
In conclusion the Nativity is the story of Christs beginning journey of love and sacrifice for ALL on this planet earth..nothing should detract from that..male or female}} |
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