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Jasmine Andrea Snow (Snowprincess)
Starlite Member
Username: Snowprincess
| | Posted on Thursday, July 07, 2005 - 08:47 pm: | 
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So, then, the only ones who are "born again" are persons who will be associated with Jesus Christ in heavenly rulership.
They are born of both water and spirit, that is, they have been baptized in water and have the spirit's witness that they have been adopted as sons of God.
Without thus being born of water and spirit they could never hope to inherit the heavenly kingdom. |
Jasmine Andrea Snow (Snowprincess)
Starlite Member
Username: Snowprincess
| | Posted on Thursday, July 07, 2005 - 08:46 pm: |
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what of the rest of humankind?
Must they, like the 144,000, be "born again"? No, for not all who gain God's approval are associated with Jesus Christ in rulership.
The majority will be earthly subjects of God's kingdom by Christ.
As such, they will witness the fulfillment of Revelation 21:4: "[God] will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore.
The former things have passed away."
Since they have earthly prospects, they are not begotten by God's spirit. Such begettal serves to engender within an individual a heavenly hope-a hope that is not shared by the earthly subjects of the Kingdom.
Nevertheless, God's spirit operates upon all his servants, just as it did upon faithful men and women of pre-Christian times.
It enables them to reflect its fruitage in their lives 'love, joy, peace, long-suffering, kindness, goodness, faith, mildness and self-control.'-Gal. 5:22, 23. g76 6\22 27-28 |
Jasmine Andrea Snow (Snowprincess)
Starlite Member
Username: Snowprincess
| | Posted on Thursday, July 07, 2005 - 08:44 pm: |
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As Jesus told Nicodemus, persons "born from the spirit" are like the wind.
In what way? This is because the original Source of their spirit-begettal is Jehovah God.
This cannot be discerned by humans generally, any more than they can see the blowing wind.
They may hear the sound of the wind and can observe its effects.
Similarly, they may note the effects that God's spirit is having on those who are "born again."
But they cannot fully appreciate the cause of these effects nor do they comprehend the heavenly destination toward which spirit-begotten persons are moving.
The Bible book of Revelation gives a specific number for those associated with Jesus Christ in rulership.
We read: "Look! the Lamb [Jesus Christ, who died a sacrificial death like a lamb offered in sacrifice] standing upon the Mount Zion, and with him a hundred and forty-four thousand having his name and the name of his Father written on their foreheads. . . .
These are the ones that keep following the Lamb no matter where he goes.
These were bought from among mankind [not from just one nation of people like the Israelites] as firstfruits to God and to the Lamb."-Rev. 14:1-4. |
Jasmine Andrea Snow (Snowprincess)
Starlite Member
Username: Snowprincess
| | Posted on Thursday, July 07, 2005 - 08:26 pm: |
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Then what was the hope of those pre-Christian servants of Jehovah?
It was a hope to live on the earth under the rule of the heavenly kingdom.
So the term "born again" does not apply to any of the early men of faith, nor does it apply today to the "great crowd" of other sheep, whose hope is to be preserved alive through the coming war of Armageddon to enjoy life on this earth forever.
The only ones who are "born again" are the 144,000, together with their Head, Christ Jesus, who make up the Kingdom. Now only a remnant of the spirit-begotten "little flock" of 144,000 are yet on earth.
But they, together with their good-will companions, are unitedly proclaiming the good news of God's new world, telling all who hear that "anyone that calls upon the name of Jehovah will be saved."-Acts 2:21, NW.
"Do your utmost to present yourself approved to God. ...handling the word of the truth aright"-2 Tim. 2:15, NW. |
Jasmine Andrea Snow (Snowprincess)
Starlite Member
Username: Snowprincess
| | Posted on Thursday, July 07, 2005 - 08:24 pm: |
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Clearly, then, there are two requisites for being "born again."
They are the water of truth and God's spirit.
Just the knowledge of God's Word in itself is not enough.
Why, during all the time that the disciples were with Jesus, including the forty days after his resurrection, Jesus taught them about God's kingdom.
They had the water of truth.
But the other requisite was lacking.
For they had yet to be 'born from the spirit.'
Until their spirit-begettal they were only prospective sons of God.
Their spirit-begettal did not take place until Pentecost.
But how are we to understand John 20:22 (NW) when Jesus, on his resurrection day, said to his disciples, "Receive holy spirit"?
That was only a symbolic action, an advance notice of what was to come.
The promised baptism of God's spirit, their begettal as spiritual sons of God, did not come until the fiftieth day counting from Jesus' resurrection.
But was not Jehovah's spirit poured out upon faithful men long before the day of Pentecost?
True, it was Jehovah's spirit that, for example, moved the prophets to write the inspired Hebrew Scriptures.
Yet none of those men were engendered thereby to become sons of God or had imparted to them a birthlike entitling to heavenly hope.
David had God's spirit upon him.
Yet he did not go to heaven.
For eleven centuries later Peter said: "David did not ascend to the heavens."
Both Elijah and Elisha had Jehovah's spirit, Elisha having a "double portion"; still they did not go to heaven.
For 900 years later the One who came down from heaven said: "No man has ascended into heaven but he that descended from heaven, the Son of man."-Acts 2:34; John 3:13, NW. |
Jasmine Andrea Snow (Snowprincess)
Starlite Member
Username: Snowprincess
| | Posted on Thursday, July 07, 2005 - 08:22 pm: |
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"BORN FROM WATER AND SPIRIT"
That phrase is how Jesus described the manner in which one is "born again."
It would not be logical to think that the "water" is literal.
Then is it referring to water baptism? No.
Rather it refers to the truth of God's Word.
This water of truth has cleansing power.
So Paul at Ephesians 5:26 (NW) speaks of Christ's cleansing the congregation "with the bath of water by means of the word."
Further showing that it is the water of truth in God's Word that aids toward the new birth, James writes: "He brought us forth by the word of truth, for us to be a certain firstfruits of his creatures."
"Also the apostle Peter shows the part played by the Word of God: "For you have been given a new birth, not by corruptible, but by incorruptible reproductive seed, through the word of the living and enduring God."
By having the good news preached to them those who become members of the 144,000 Kingdom heirs get in intelligent touch with God.
It is God's Word that sets out the heavenly hope; and only by getting to know his Word could they have such a hope formed in their hearts.-Jas. 1:18; 1 Pet. 1:23, NW.
The apostle Peter brought the "water" or word of truth to the first Gentile convert, Cornelius.
Cornelius, together with those of his household, accepted it. The Bible record says: "While Peter was yet speaking about these matters the holy spirit fell upon all those hearing the word.
"It was after this that Peter responded: "Can anyone forbid water so that these might not be baptized who have received the holy spirit even as we have?"
So in Cornelius' case, unlike that of Jesus', his water baptism came after his being "born again.
"Hence water baptism, though essential, does not bring about the new birth nor does it necessarily precede a faithful creature's being "born again."-Acts 10:44, 47, NW. |
Jasmine Andrea Snow (Snowprincess)
Starlite Member
Username: Snowprincess
| | Posted on Thursday, July 07, 2005 - 08:18 pm: |
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THE NEED FOR A NEW BIRTH
Why, now, must those of the 144,000 Kingdom heirs be "born again"?
Because as human creatures they were begotten by Adam.
Adam could not beget anyone to a heavenly inheritance. He had only earthly hopes held out to him. Moreover, when Adam did beget children they were born sinners. So Adam's children inherited sin and death. Thus the 144,000 need to be begotten by a father different from Adam, a heavenly father who can bestow spirit life and a spiritual inheritance.
(((Only Jehovah can do that.))))
Being born from God, the 144,000 Kingdom heirs become spiritual sons of God: "However, as many as did receive him, to them he gave authority to become God's children, because they were exercising faith in his name; and they were born not from blood or from a fleshly will or from man's will, but from God."-John 1:12, 13, NW.
Jesus was the first one to be "born again."
This was in harmony with God's rule concerning his Son: "That he might become the one who is first in all things."
When was Jesus "born again"? At the time of his human birth? No, but rather thirty years later, at the time of his baptism A.D. 29.
After Jesus' immersion, an act that symbolized Jesus' dedication to Jehovah, God's spirit came upon him, and a voice from the heavens said: "This is my Son, the beloved, whom I have approved."
Jesus was now a spirit-begotten son of God; he was "born again."
This, of course, was not a begettal in the womb of any human virgin.
That was already past and had served its purpose.
But now Jehovah begot Jesus by the spirit to become a spiritual son of God with a heavenly glory in view. This was the first time such a thing had ever occurred on earth.-Col. 1:18; Matt. 3:17, NW.
So what does it mean to be "born again"? It means receiving from God a birthlike entitling to prospects and hopes for spirit life by resurrection to heaven. How is this brought about?
Jesus enlightens us: "Most truly I say to you, Unless anyone is born from water and spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God."-John 3:5, NW. |
Jasmine Andrea Snow (Snowprincess)
Starlite Member
Username: Snowprincess
| | Posted on Thursday, July 07, 2005 - 08:16 pm: |
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Who Are Born Again?
According to the Scriptures inside the Bible:
Jesus' words, those words he spoke one night to Nicodemus: "Most truly I say to you, Unless anyone is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." (John 3:3, NW)
Did Jesus here mean that it is necessary for anyone who hopes for life to be "born again"?
What really does it mean to be "born again"?
To understand what it means to be "born again" one must know who are "born again."
Note carefully that, in discussing this matter, Jesus did not say that all who would gain everlasting life must be "born again.
"Rather, what he said was that unless one was "born again" he could not see the "kingdom of God."
Now the kingdom of God is heavenly.
Jehovah has purposed that the Kingdom be the capital or ruling part of his universal organization.
Jehovah also purposed that a limited number, taken from among mankind, would reign with Christ Jesus as associate kings. For this sublime privilege they must be resurrected and given spirit bodies, since, as the apostle said, "flesh and blood cannot inherit God's kingdom."
That the Father has set a limitation on the number of those who will reign with his Son in the heavenly kingdom is manifest from Jesus' words: "Have no fear, little flock, because your Father has approved of giving you the kingdom."
The exact number of the "little flock" approved by the Father to be Kingdom heirs was not known until Christ, through an angel, revealed it to be 144,000 "who have been purchased from the earth."
This "little flock" of 144,000 Kingdom heirs, then, are those ones from among mankind who are "born again."-1 Cor. 15:50; Luke 12:32; Rev. 14:1-3, NW.
Hence it is a gross twisting of the Scriptures to throw open Jesus' words at John 3:3 to make them embrace all mankind.
This is because the vast majority of mankind who receive salvation will not be part of the "kingdom of God" but will live on the earth under the rule of God's kingdom.
For in addition to his "little flock" of Kingdom heirs Jesus has his "other sheep, which are not of this fold"; that is, they are not of the little fold.
The number of these "other sheep" is not limited.
Today a "great crowd" of these "other sheep" has been gathered into Jehovah's New World society: "A great crowd, which no man was able to number, out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues."
This "great crowd" of people are not "born again," nor do they need to be "born again," because they gain everlasting life on the earth.-John 10:16; Rev. 7:9, NW.w54 11\15 681-683 |
Scott Whitmore (Emhotep)
Starlite Member
Username: Emhotep
| | Posted on Thursday, July 07, 2005 - 12:59 am: |
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Now as to Your
Post about the " SHAPE OF THE CROSS " Jasmine I do
tend to agree with you in this area. Looking back
into true records & gylphs of the time it clearly
shows that there was a scafolding built for doing
the CRUCIFIXIONS. Those who were crucified had to
carry the CROSS BOARD with them. The first symbol
to be used by CHRISTIANS was of a fish upon their
LEFT FOUNDATION STONE of the home
Ona Gwe, Waki
Wm Scott Whitmore
aka
Em~Hotep
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Scott Whitmore (Emhotep)
Starlite Member
Username: Emhotep
| | Posted on Thursday, July 07, 2005 - 12:38 am: |
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When
talking of " Jesus Christ & Suicide " , Jesus did
what he KNEW AND FELT BEST TO DO. Put Yourself in
a situation where your child needs a NEW HEART &
You are the matching donor who can SAVE THAT LIFE,
do you think you would do it. what if was a sister
or a brother. We all are the Lord's childern, and
just as a TRULY LOVING PARENT WOULD HE GAVE UP THE
ULTAMATE SACRAFICE. SOMETHING I AM WILLING TO DO
FOR ANY CHILD, just think it in those terms and I
bet You will understand there is a differance in
SUICIDE & what JESUS CHRIST did.
Scott Whitmore
zanthor2691@aol.com
I am always here for a talk
 }
Ona Gwe, Waki
Wm Scott Whitmore
aka
Em~Hotep
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Jasmine Andrea Snow (Snowprincess)
Starlite Member
Username: Snowprincess
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2005 - 11:58 pm: |
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'"And in the last days," God says, "I shall pour out some of my spirit upon every sort of flesh, }and YOUR sons and YOUR daughters will prophesy and YOUR young men will see visions and YOUR old men will dream dreams; and even upon my men slaves and upon my women slaves I will pour out some of my spirit in those days, and they will prophesy." _Acts 2:17-18
"What gives evidence that a person really has the holy spirit, or "the Holy Ghost" (KJ)?
Luke 4:18, 31-35: "[Jesus read from the scroll of the prophet Isaiah:] 'Jehovah's spirit is upon me, because he anointed me to declare good news' . . . And he went down to Capernaum, a city of Galilee. ...
And he was teaching them on the sabbath; and they were astounded at his way of teaching, because his speech was with authority.
Now in the synagogue there was a man with a spirit, an unclean demon, and he shouted with a loud voice . . . But Jesus rebuked it, saying: 'Be silent, and come out of him.' So, after throwing the man down in their midst, the demon came out of him without hurting him."
(What gave evidence that Jesus had God's spirit?
The account does not say that he trembled or shouted or moved about in a fervor.
Rather, it says he spoke with authority.
It is noteworthy, however, that on that occasion a demonic spirit did move a man to shout and fall onto the floor.)
Acts 1:8 says that when Jesus' followers received holy spirit they would be witnesses about him.
According to Acts 2:1-11, when they did receive that spirit, observers were impressed by the fact that, although the ones speaking were all Galileans, they were speaking about the magnificent things of God in languages that were familiar to the many foreigners who were present.
But the record does not say that there were any emotional outbursts on the part of those who received the spirit.
It is noteworthy that when Elizabeth received the holy spirit and then gave voice to "a loud cry" she was not in a meeting for worship but was greeting a visiting relative. (Luke 1:41, 42)
When, as reported at Acts 4:31, holy spirit came upon an assembly of disciples, the place was shaken, but the effect of that spirit on the disciples was, not that they trembled or rolled about, but that they 'spoke the word of God with boldness.'
Likewise today, boldness in speaking the word of God, zealously engaging in the work of witnessing-these are what give evidence that a person has holy spirit.
Gal. 5:22, 23: "The fruitage of the spirit is love, joy, peace, long-suffering, kindness, goodness, faith, mildness, self-control."
(It is this fruitage, rather than outbursts of religious fervor, that one should look for when seeking to find people who truly have God's spirit.) rs 380-384 |
Jasmine Andrea Snow (Snowprincess)
Starlite Member
Username: Snowprincess
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2005 - 11:50 pm: |
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What is the holy spirit?
A comparison of Bible texts that refer to the holy spirit shows that it is spoken of as 'filling' people; they can be 'baptized' with it; and they can be "anointed" with it. (Luke 1:41; Matt. 3:11; Acts 10:38)
None of these expressions would be appropriate if the holy spirit were a person.
Jesus also referred to the holy spirit as a "helper" (Greek, pa·ra“kle·tos), and he said that this helper would "teach," "bear witness," "speak," and 'hear.' (John 14:16, 17, 26; 15:26; 16:13)
It is not unusual in the Scriptures for something to be personified.
For example, wisdom is said to have "children." (Luke 7:35)
Sin and death are spoken of as being kings. (Rom. 5:14, 21) While some texts say that the spirit "spoke," other passages make clear that this was done through angels or humans. (Acts 4:24, 25; 28:25; Matt. 10:19, 20; compare Acts 20:23 with 21:10, 11.) At 1 John 5:6-8, not only the spirit but also "the water and the blood" are said to 'bear witness.'
So, none of the expressions found in these texts in themselves prove that the holy spirit is a person.
The correct identification of the holy spirit must fit all the scriptures that refer to that spirit.
With this viewpoint, it is logical to conclude that the holy spirit is the active force of God.
It is not a person but is a powerful force that God causes to emanate from himself to accomplish his holy will.-Ps. 104:30; 2 Pet. 1:21; Acts 4:31. |
Jasmine Andrea Snow (Snowprincess)
Starlite Member
Username: Snowprincess
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2005 - 11:46 pm: |
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Paul urged Timothy: 'Keep holding the pattern of healthful words that you heard from me with the faith and love that are in connection with Christ Jesus.' (2 Timothy 1:13)
Eccl. 3:19-21: "There is an eventuality as respects the sons of mankind and an eventuality as respects the beast, and they have the same eventuality.
As the one dies, so the other dies; and they all have but one spirit, so that there is no superiority of the man over the beast, for everything is vanity.
All are going to one place. They have all come to be from the dust, and they are all returning to the dust.
Who is there knowing the spirit of the sons of mankind, whether it is ascending upward; and the spirit of the beast, whether it is descending downward to the earth?"
(Because of the inheritance of sin and death from Adam, humans all die and return to the dust, as animals do.
But does each human have a spirit that goes on living as an intelligent personality after it ceases to function in the body? No;
verse 19 answers that humans and beasts "all have but one spirit."
Based merely on human observation, no one can authoritatively answer the question raised in verse 21 regarding the spirit.
But God's Word answers that there is nothing that humans have as a result of birth that gives them superiority over beasts when they die.
However, because of God's merciful provision through Christ, the prospect of living forever has been opened up to humans who exercise faith, but not to animals.
For many of mankind, that will be made possible by resurrection, when active life-force from God will invigorate them again.)
Luke 23:46: "Jesus called with a loud voice and said: 'Father, into your hands I entrust my spirit [Greek, pneu“ma“].' When he had said this, he expired." (Notice that Jesus expired.
When his spirit went out he was not on his way to heaven.
Not until the third day from this was Jesus resurrected from the dead.
Then, as Acts 1:3, 9 shows, it was 40 more days before he ascended to heaven.
So, what is the meaning of what Jesus said at the time of his death?
He was saying that he knew that, when he died, his future life prospects rested entirely with God. |
Jasmine Andrea Snow (Snowprincess)
Starlite Member
Username: Snowprincess
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2005 - 10:56 pm: |
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Clearly there is no Scriptural support for the traditional cross as a symbol of Christianity.
Then how can its adoption by professed Christians be accounted for?
It was borrowed from the surrounding pagans.
It is another one of the many paganisms that the early apostate Christians adopted so as to appeal to the pagans and to be more like them.
In this they followed the example of the Israelites who wanted a king so as to be like the nations round about.
Thus Dr. Killen, in his Ancient Church, writes:
"From the most remote antiquity the cross was venerated in Egypt and Syria; it was held in equal honor by the Buddhists of the East; and what is still more extraordinary, when the Spaniards first visited America, the well-known sign was found among the objects of worship in the idol temples of Anįhuac.
It is also remarkable that, with the commencement of our era, the pagans were wont to make the sign of the cross upon the forehead in the celebration of some of their sacred mysteries." |
Jasmine Andrea Snow (Snowprincess)
Starlite Member
Username: Snowprincess
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2005 - 10:52 pm: |
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"This is fine and acceptable in the sight of our Savior, God, whose will is that all sorts of men should be saved and come to an accurate knowledge of truth. ...
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, a man, Christ Jesus, who gave himself a corresponding ransom for all" _1 Timothy 2:3-6
What does God's Word teach us:
That Christ did not die on the traditionally shaped cross is also indicated by the Bible itself.
It repeatedly tells of his dying on a tree, the Greek word being xylon. (See Luke 23:31; Acts 5:30;10:39.)
Xylon simply means "timber," and "by implication a stick, club or tree or other wooden article or substance."5 That is why the Gospel writers all use xylon to refer to the staves or clubs that the mob carried when they came to take Jesus. (See Matthew 26:47, 55; Mark 14:43, 48; Luke 22:52.)
By saying that Christ died on a xylon these indicated that Christ died on a timber, a piece of wood.
Thus the apostle Paul states that Christ became a curse to those under the law by being fastened to a xylon, since "Accursed is every man hanged upon a stake [xylon]."
Paul was there quoting from the law of Moses, which required that the bodies of executed criminals be fastened to a tree or stake as a warning and which meant that they were cursed by God.-Gal. 3:13; Deut. 21:22, 23, NW.
A like example is found relative to one of the decrees of Cyrus, which warned that anyone refusing to obey, "a timber will be pulled out of his house and he will be impaled upon it."
In the Greek Septuagint Version the term for timber here is xylon.
(((Again, not a cross but a simple straight beam.-Ezra 6:11, NW.))))
Some argue that Christ died on a cross because early Christians used the letter "X" as a symbol for Christ.
However, the "X" used in this manner does not at all refer to the tree on which Christ died.
Rather, it stands for the name "Christ," it being the first (Greek) letter of the name "Christ," written "X" and pronounced "ch" or "K." Thus "X" is an abbreviation, not a symbol.
Nor does the fact that the Epistle of Barnabas and the Gospel of Nicodemus state that Jesus died on a cross prove anything. Both of these works are recognized by all authorities as forgeries.
Obviously both were written after the cross had been adopted as a symbol of Christendom.
The traditionally shaped cross has long been accepted by many as the symbol of the Christian religion.
Is that what the Bible and the facts of history show? Clearly there is no Scriptural support for the traditional cross as a symbol of Christianity. w57 3\15 165-168 |
Jasmine Andrea Snow (Snowprincess)
Starlite Member
Username: Snowprincess
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2005 - 10:35 pm: |
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What is the TRUTH about the cross; "WHY NOT A TRADITIONAL CROSS"
Certainly in view of the foregoing it cannot honestly be stated that Christ without doubt was nailed on the traditionally shaped cross.
And it is of striking interest to note that it is those authorities that lean toward the view that Christ was nailed on such a cross that admit doubt.
But those who hold that Christ died on a simple stake or pole are not in doubt. Says one such: "Jesus died on a simple deathstake: In support of this there speak (a) the then customary usage of this means of execution in the Orient, (b) indirectly the history itself of Jesus' sufferings and (c) many expressions of the early Church fathers."-The Cross and Crucifixion, Hermann Fulda.
That Christ did not die on the traditionally shaped cross is also indicated by the testimony of the catacombs.
Thus Dean Burgon, in his Letters from Rome, wrote: "I question whether a cross occurs on any Christian monument of the first four centuries."
Mons Perret, who spent fourteen years doing research in the catacombs of Rome, counted in all a total of 11,000 inscriptions among the millions of tombs.
According to him, "not until the latter years of the fourth century does the sign of the cross appear."
Among the signs that do appear are the dove, a symbol of the holy spirit; the lyre, a symbol of joy; the anchor, a symbol of hope and the fish.
Why the fish?
Because the letters of the word "fish" in Greek are the same as the first letters of "Jesus Christ, God's Son, Savior." |
Jasmine Andrea Snow (Snowprincess)
Starlite Member
Username: Snowprincess
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2005 - 10:28 pm: |
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The facts are that authorities are not agreed that there is "no doubt" about the nature of the stauros on which Christ died and are not agreed that it was the traditionally shaped cross.
The Encyclopędia Britannica, 1907 and 1942 editions, under the term "cross" states that Christ is "generally believed" to have died on such a cross, that at best it is only "by general tradition" that the matter is established.
As for religious authorities, one states: "The accounts of the manner of the crucifixion being so meager, any degree of certainty is impossible."
And another tells that "no definite data are found in the New Testament concerning the nature of the cross on which Jesus died.
It is only the Church writers after Justin Martyr who indicate the composite four-armed cross as Christ's vehicle of torture."
And concerning the terms stauros and crux we are told that 'stauros properly means merely a stake.'
"In Livy [Roman historian shortly before Christ's ministry] even, crux means a mere stake."
"The Hebrews have no word for Cross more definite than 'wood.'"
(Message edited by snowprincess on July 06, 2005) |
ALIANNE OUSSAMEUR (Alianne)
Starlite Member
Username: Alianne
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2005 - 09:15 pm: |
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Thank you for responding so soon to my questions.
I would really appreciate if you would post the Scriptures.
I am looking forward to hearing from you, Alianne |
B.J. Proffitt Thornton (Skydancer)
Starlite Member
Username: Skydancer
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2005 - 04:39 am: |
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P.s. (Alianne) one sentence per question, well I think that would be impossible for me, but perhaps I can get you in touch with someone who could answer each question with one sentence.
But I hoped that made it a little clearer than mud. That is why we will spend years reading the Bible, ( Holy Scriptures are that which is the teaching within the Bible) and still not learn everything. So, we read it again.
Skydancer
B.J. Proffitt Thornton
"blessed are they who have seen and believe, but more blessed are they who believe, and have not seen" (Jesus Christ from the Chistian Bible)
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B.J. Proffitt Thornton (Skydancer)
Starlite Member
Username: Skydancer
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2005 - 04:28 am: |
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Jehovah, or Yahweh as it is pronounced in some editions of the Bible, and there are many, is God, the creator of earth, who in seven days created it all in the beginning, God says himself "I am the great I am, the alpha and the omega" again out of the old testament, so those are all the same person, the one and only God.
Who is born again? Anyone who accepts Jesus Christ the son of God, born of the virgin Mary, as was predicted in the old testament, who is also the ultimate sacrificial lamb, the one Jesus Christ who was cruicified on the cross, by His own people with the crown of thorns on His head, suffered and died taking all our sins with him. Carrying our burdens, so that we could be forgiven. The devil quivers at the hearing His name, the one who overcame evil and sin.The one and only son of God. Jesus Christ.
To be born again, a human, must accept Him, as the Son of God, believe in Him with all their heart and soul and pray for forgiveness of their sins, admitting their sins, admitting that we, or I as the case was with me, was a sinner and fell far short of perfection, that if the Lord my God would hear my prayer, look into my heart, He would see, that I do believe that Jesus Is My personal Savior and the savior of all mankind and without accepting him, we can not enter heaven. Jesus said, " I am the truth , the way and the life, unless you believeth in Me, you can not enter the Kindom of Heaven" We must be washed in His Holy Blood, which He shed on the cross for us, and by total acceptance of Him and that you or I, whatever the case may be, believe He is the Son of God, that He died for our sins, and are washed in His holy blood by that acceptance and confession to God (ie Yahweh ie Jehovah,) and to others of that belief.
My spirit as i refer to it there,is the soul that is within me, not my body, that is earthly, but that which God gave me my soul, some call it spririt, when I was born, or before, because I was before, and will be after, the spirit never dies.
The Holy Spirit to me is a third of the triangle which unites us to Jesus, who unites us to God. He gave unto us a Holy spirit, after He was resurrected from the dead and before He ascended. He said I must leave you now, and go unto my Father, who is in heaven, but I give to you a comforter, a teacher," from experience i know that the holy spirit bears witness to my spirit, that is who the Holy Spirit is, it is an entity, a Spirit that resides within us and bears witness to our spirit of what is right and wrong, what we should and should not do, it also allows us and gives some of us the ability to discern , discern good from evil in the senses.Some can heal the sick, these are gifts, I have always been able to know what is evil and know what is good.
The Holy Trinity, many believe that God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit are all one, that is debatable, I do not think they are. The Bible brings out too many instances where when baptised the Holy Spirit descended on the wings of a dove to Jesus and a voice said " This is my Son, in whom I am well pleased." The same voice that commanded Moses to go into the Mountain and wrote the ten commandment's by fire in stone. The voice of God. Some believe they are one, I do not, it is a personal decision we all make upon reading the scriptures.
The Bible does not say Jesus committed suicide, but He did allow Himself to suffer and die on the cross, willingly, this performer of miracles, who could resurrect the dead, cure the ill, and fed 10,000 or more with only a few fish and very little bread bread. He could calm the storm and walk on water. He could cast out demons, and so many more things that all the books in the world could not contain what He did do. Hence, He could have called down a league of angels to help him prevent the crusifiction, or take Him off that cross, but He did not, He allowed it to happen, for us, who would chose to believe. Again, that is a personal thought, one which many debate, many agree with, many do not.( that he was allowing actually a suicide ) Now I can look up and give you scriptures to support all the above, but it would take awhile.It is all in the Holy Bible, You just have to read it. I did.
Skydancer
B.J. Proffitt Thornton
"blessed are they who have seen and believe, but more blessed are they who believe, and have not seen" (Jesus Christ from the Chistian Bible)
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ALIANNE OUSSAMEUR (Alianne)
Starlite Member
Username: Alianne
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 05, 2005 - 09:54 pm: |
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Hi!Skydancer: I have seen the postings and I am wondering if you beleive that Jesus is Yaweh or Jehovah??Who is the Alpha and Omega??Who are born again??Did the scriptures say that Jesus comitted suicide?? What is the holy spirit??Do you believe in the trinity??I am confused and would like to hear your thoughts on the scriptures. but please one sentence for every answer as I get confused with long answers. I am also curious as to what you mean by "my spirit" as mentioned here by you:"I listened to the scriptures and to my spirit," I found your posting interesting and looking forward to hearing from you, Alianne |
B.J. Proffitt Thornton (Skydancer)
Starlite Member
Username: Skydancer
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 05, 2005 - 03:06 am: |
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my viewpoint on suicide is this, i noticed one person did quote the old testament, but Jesus, 'fulfilled' the old testament. Also, if you are born again, you can not be unborn again, just like a child who is born, even though he may die right after birth, he was still 'born' and could never crawl back into the mothers womb and be unborn. So if you are "born again," you can not be "unborn again." Born again is the accepting of Jesus Christ as your personal savior, that He was and is and always will be the living son of God,who died for our sins, upon the cross, our sins. All of "our sins' were in the future, so hence if you are born again, hit a rough patch, opt out for suicide for whatever reason, that sin too is forgivin.There are many view points on the suicide issue, I don't think we should commit suicide, but I do not believe a person goes to hell, the burning eternal hell where Satan is master, for this act if he once accept Jesus in the way it describes above. Many people who do commint suicide are temporarly insane, if not mentally ill in some fasion. The God I know as my personal savior would be forgiving of that.
Also, others have said before me, and it is a good point, the greatest most notable suicide of all, was Jesus Christ , the son of God , Himself. He could have came down off that cross anytime he wanted, but chose to die, for us, so the curtain in the temple was rent apart, and God and man could be united through His Son's blood, willingly spilled, for forgiveness of all our sins, if we believe and accept Him. There are so many arguable points in committing suicide, both forgiven or not forgiven, it blows a person's mind. I only know what I believe. I believe Jesus was and is the living Son of God, Jehovah or Yawee, and I also believe Jesus came here for a purpose, to teach, preach, and show us the way, through believing in Him as the Son of the one and only God, the alpha and the Omega, and the willing sacrifice of His own blood. Acceptance of Him, Jesus Christ, is a washing in that blood of our spirits, and then all our sins are pardoned, all... past present future and forevermore.
Now this is just my viewpoint on suicide as I see it, and no one can change my mind because I listened to the scriptures and to my spirit, then later the Holy spirit, who revealed to my spirit, the above.
That is my view, and as for me and my house we serve Jesus Christ, the Son of God.
sky
Skydancer
B.J. Proffitt Thornton
"blessed are they who have seen and believe, but more blessed are they who believe, and have not seen" (Jesus Christ from the Chistian Bible)
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